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	<title>Comments on: PERFECT example of bureaucracy vs. process</title>
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	<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/</link>
	<description>A starting point for a discussion on marrying Agile methods and CMMI.</description>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-17</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 00:57:59 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Good discussion, I have pretty much had my say here.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I see where you are going and understand the appearance of redundancy; however I tend to give the Passport Office the benefit of the doubt here.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If the requirements had not had changed from when your child’s passport was first issued, and details of the birth certificate noted, I would tend to agree with you. &lt;br/&gt;However the new requirement:-&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Effective February 1, 2008, 22 C.F.R. 51.1 requires that U.S. passport applications for children under the age of 16 require both parents’ and legal guardians&#039; consent.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Gives new meaning to how the ‘birth certificate’ is used. The process of recording and auditing this information now has to pass a higher threshold if indeed the passport is to be used in place of the birth certificate to establish relationship. Also the difference between guardian and birth parent has to be explicitly recorded. &lt;br/&gt;As I stated I feel this example is not a clean one, in terms of your point, although I accept the underlying principles you are articulating.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good discussion, I have pretty much had my say here.</p>
<p>I see where you are going and understand the appearance of redundancy; however I tend to give the Passport Office the benefit of the doubt here.</p>
<p>If the requirements had not had changed from when your child’s passport was first issued, and details of the birth certificate noted, I would tend to agree with you. <br />However the new requirement:-</p>
<p>Effective February 1, 2008, 22 C.F.R. 51.1 requires that U.S. passport applications for children under the age of 16 require both parents’ and legal guardians&#8217; consent.</p>
<p>Gives new meaning to how the ‘birth certificate’ is used. The process of recording and auditing this information now has to pass a higher threshold if indeed the passport is to be used in place of the birth certificate to establish relationship. Also the difference between guardian and birth parent has to be explicitly recorded. <br />As I stated I feel this example is not a clean one, in terms of your point, although I accept the underlying principles you are articulating.</p>
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		<title>By: Hillel</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-16</link>
		<dc:creator>Hillel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 19:25:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Anonymous,&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If the supposition in the bureaucracy is that the parents&#039; appearance, pictures, and names align with the child&#039;s named parents (on the birth certificate), and instead of providing a birth certificate, the re-application includes all the same information + the prior passport + the appearance of the parents with their IDs, then there is no operational difference between a prior passport and the birth certificate since the prior passport established everything in the first place.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;The failure of this procedure is that it assumes names don&#039;t change over time and/or that identities aren&#039;t stolen.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Since the birth certificate is only a reasonable level of assurance, not a guarantee, then for the majority of situations, the prior passport is just as reasonable an assurance.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;I suspect, however, that I/we and the DOS (and those in the child-protection field) might disagree on how we respectively define &quot;reasonable level of assurance&quot;.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;We&#039;re TOTALLY in favor of ensuring children are positively identified with their rightful parents/guardians, and our only point in bringing up this post is that given the holes in the procedure and combined with not-uncommon situation, the procedure was too restrictive and doesn&#039;t account for variation in the possible inputs defining the scenario as the business rule is applied.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;Feel free to disagree, but it is possible to &quot;write tests&quot; that the procedure, as it currently is defined, will fail in two modes: (1) bad input still produces outcomes within expected ranges, and (2) a subset of good input causes an unhandled exception.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anonymous,</p>
<p>If the supposition in the bureaucracy is that the parents&#8217; appearance, pictures, and names align with the child&#8217;s named parents (on the birth certificate), and instead of providing a birth certificate, the re-application includes all the same information + the prior passport + the appearance of the parents with their IDs, then there is no operational difference between a prior passport and the birth certificate since the prior passport established everything in the first place.  </p>
<p>The failure of this procedure is that it assumes names don&#8217;t change over time and/or that identities aren&#8217;t stolen.</p>
<p>Since the birth certificate is only a reasonable level of assurance, not a guarantee, then for the majority of situations, the prior passport is just as reasonable an assurance.</p>
<p>I suspect, however, that I/we and the DOS (and those in the child-protection field) might disagree on how we respectively define &#8220;reasonable level of assurance&#8221;.</p>
<p>We&#8217;re TOTALLY in favor of ensuring children are positively identified with their rightful parents/guardians, and our only point in bringing up this post is that given the holes in the procedure and combined with not-uncommon situation, the procedure was too restrictive and doesn&#8217;t account for variation in the possible inputs defining the scenario as the business rule is applied.</p>
<p>Feel free to disagree, but it is possible to &#8220;write tests&#8221; that the procedure, as it currently is defined, will fail in two modes: (1) bad input still produces outcomes within expected ranges, and (2) a subset of good input causes an unhandled exception.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-15</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 19:07:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&quot;If there has been some sort of change in the child&#039;s status, neither the DOS nor the USPS would know it from the birth certificate and appearance of parents alone.&quot;.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;That&#039;s the whole point, all of the documents establishing the link from the birth certificate to the current ID of the guardians needs to be presented each time a passport is granted for a minor.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;There are many issues with ID thefts etc. but I see no reason to alter this process of establishing the current child&#039;s guardians by linking to the legal documentation trail to the birth certificate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If there has been some sort of change in the child&#8217;s status, neither the DOS nor the USPS would know it from the birth certificate and appearance of parents alone.&#8221;.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the whole point, all of the documents establishing the link from the birth certificate to the current ID of the guardians needs to be presented each time a passport is granted for a minor.</p>
<p>There are many issues with ID thefts etc. but I see no reason to alter this process of establishing the current child&#8217;s guardians by linking to the legal documentation trail to the birth certificate.</p>
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		<title>By: Hillel</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-14</link>
		<dc:creator>Hillel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:42:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Anonymous, you&#039;re failing to realize that the birth certificate is only a valid proof of parentage if there have been no changes in the child&#039;s status.  If there has been some sort of change in the child&#039;s status, neither the DOS nor the USPS would know it from the birth certificate and appearance of parents alone.  Especially in these days of widespread identity theft, these paper-based forms of ID verification are insufficient, and therefore the requirement to appear with both parents and a birth certificate is no more &quot;assurance&quot; than appearing with a prior passport.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anonymous, you&#8217;re failing to realize that the birth certificate is only a valid proof of parentage if there have been no changes in the child&#8217;s status.  If there has been some sort of change in the child&#8217;s status, neither the DOS nor the USPS would know it from the birth certificate and appearance of parents alone.  Especially in these days of widespread identity theft, these paper-based forms of ID verification are insufficient, and therefore the requirement to appear with both parents and a birth certificate is no more &#8220;assurance&#8221; than appearing with a prior passport.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-13</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:42:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Sorry last line should read&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;&quot;but how does anyone know that unless they review the child’s Birth Certificate and evidence of the current guardianship status.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry last line should read</p>
<p>&#8220;but how does anyone know that unless they review the child’s Birth Certificate and evidence of the current guardianship status.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-12</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:39:34 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Let’s say there was a difference between the child’s current legal guardians and the parents listed on the child&#039;s birth certificate. When there is a difference like this all the legal documentation that establishes the changes from the birth certificate to the current legal guardians needs to be presented, so that permission from the current legal guardians can be established. These changes will include adoption, parents name changes etc. What you are saying is that if there was a difference (current guardians and birth parents) it would have been allowed for when the previous passport was granted. This is OK for most cases, but considers court orders (custody) arrangements of guardianship that are dynamic or temporary. In these cases the link between the birth certificate and current guardians needs to be reviewed. You can argue in your particular case this did not apply, but how does anyone know that unless they review the child’s passport and current guardianship status.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let’s say there was a difference between the child’s current legal guardians and the parents listed on the child&#8217;s birth certificate. When there is a difference like this all the legal documentation that establishes the changes from the birth certificate to the current legal guardians needs to be presented, so that permission from the current legal guardians can be established. These changes will include adoption, parents name changes etc. What you are saying is that if there was a difference (current guardians and birth parents) it would have been allowed for when the previous passport was granted. This is OK for most cases, but considers court orders (custody) arrangements of guardianship that are dynamic or temporary. In these cases the link between the birth certificate and current guardians needs to be reviewed. You can argue in your particular case this did not apply, but how does anyone know that unless they review the child’s passport and current guardianship status.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-11</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 18:06:24 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>The argument hinges on the validity of the stated fact that only a birth certificate and a traceable change (i.e. adoption, guardianship papers etc.) can establish the parental relationship for a minor (not an expired passport). What follows from the validity of that fact is self evident regarding the process, its value and any acquisitions of bureaucracy. In essence the birth certificate is not needed to prove the child is a US citizen that can be done with the previous passport. What you are debating is the validity (or usefulness) of these rules http://travel.state.gov/passport/&lt;br/&gt;get/minors/minors_834.html from the dept of state. On balance I do not see any good reason for these rules to be changed; certainly we should at least consider the fact that there may be some value in these rules before making criticism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The argument hinges on the validity of the stated fact that only a birth certificate and a traceable change (i.e. adoption, guardianship papers etc.) can establish the parental relationship for a minor (not an expired passport). What follows from the validity of that fact is self evident regarding the process, its value and any acquisitions of bureaucracy. In essence the birth certificate is not needed to prove the child is a US citizen that can be done with the previous passport. What you are debating is the validity (or usefulness) of these rules <a href="http://travel.state.gov/passport/" rel="nofollow">http://travel.state.gov/passport/</a><br />get/minors/minors_834.html from the dept of state. On balance I do not see any good reason for these rules to be changed; certainly we should at least consider the fact that there may be some value in these rules before making criticism.</p>
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		<title>By: Hillel</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-10</link>
		<dc:creator>Hillel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Nov 2008 02:52:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hi Anonymous,&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;If your argument (more to the point, your defense of the rule) were to hold together, the child&#039;s birth certificate also wouldn&#039;t establish evidence of relationship.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;And, in our case, both parents were present, and, the prior passport used the same evidence as what they required the first time, as though he didn&#039;t have a passport.  &lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;In other words, the process designers didn&#039;t validate their requirements (i.e., make sure the requirements withstand the test of the actual user environment).  So, while they may have declared their Business Rule or Requirement of the Process &quot;valid&quot;, they did so without actually testing to see if it holds together.  In other words, it wasn&#039;t truly &quot;valid&quot;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Anonymous,</p>
<p>If your argument (more to the point, your defense of the rule) were to hold together, the child&#8217;s birth certificate also wouldn&#8217;t establish evidence of relationship.</p>
<p>And, in our case, both parents were present, and, the prior passport used the same evidence as what they required the first time, as though he didn&#8217;t have a passport.  </p>
<p>In other words, the process designers didn&#8217;t validate their requirements (i.e., make sure the requirements withstand the test of the actual user environment).  So, while they may have declared their Business Rule or Requirement of the Process &#8220;valid&#8221;, they did so without actually testing to see if it holds together.  In other words, it wasn&#8217;t truly &#8220;valid&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.agilecmmi.com/index.php/2008/10/perfect-example-of-bureaucracy-vs-process/comment-page-1/#comment-9</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Nov 2008 03:24:15 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Ref: Child&#039;s birth certificate.&lt;br/&gt;&lt;br/&gt;It is to do with the new requirement that both parents have to give their consent for a minor to have a US passport. This came into effect recently, I think Feb 2008. Anyway bottom line is &lt;br/&gt;&quot;Previous U.S. passports are not acceptable as evidence of relationship&quot;. You can go thru the divorce name change arguments etc. but this fact holds (for the process designers) and as such is a valid Business Rule or Requirement of the process.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ref: Child&#8217;s birth certificate.</p>
<p>It is to do with the new requirement that both parents have to give their consent for a minor to have a US passport. This came into effect recently, I think Feb 2008. Anyway bottom line is <br />&#8220;Previous U.S. passports are not acceptable as evidence of relationship&#8221;. You can go thru the divorce name change arguments etc. but this fact holds (for the process designers) and as such is a valid Business Rule or Requirement of the process.</p>
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